The OtherArena Forum IndexThe OtherArena Forum IndexThe OtherArena Forum Index The OtherArena
"Best not to think about it. I know that's a problem for you... not thinking. " -Steve Yohe
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

2015/2016 NBA Thread
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... , 31, 32, 33  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The OtherArena Forum Index -> Sports
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Steve Yohe



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 3125
Location: Wonderful Montebello CA

PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2016 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I won another dinner. Ramsey Bolton and Curry done on the same night. Perfect.---Yohe
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
guren



Joined: 31 Jul 2006
Posts: 1205

PostPosted: Sun Jun 19, 2016 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I was really surprised by Curry's performance today. I held on to the fantasy that this was the Year of Curry and he would come through like he did in Game 7 of the WCF.

Before today, he seemed to achieve everything that was possible and get certain breaks. To whit:

- Escaped serious injury in the OKC game when RWB landed on his leg
- Finished the season over 30 ppg
- Became a member of the 50/45/90 club
- Surpassed 400 3-pointers (basically achieved these last 3 due to a 46pt, 10 3-pointer performance)
- Led his team to a record-breaking 73 regular season wins
- Won MVP again
- Escaped a season-ending injury to his knee against Houston (got the best possible result from his MRI)
- Came back from the knee-injury to break the record for most points in an overtime against Portland
- Had a great game and hit the signature shot of the WCF Game 7

Welp, the torch has been passed back to LeBron at least for the next several months.

glenn
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JAG



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 2298

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think Curry got exposed as a one-trick pony. It's a helluva trick, but the idea of him being the best player in the league (which I was riding with it during this season) is absurd.

No hyperbole, I'd rather have Klay.

Jagdip
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
corrado



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 5008
Location: LI

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ive been saying for a while that Draymond could be more vital than the Splash Brothers. And Game 7 was another good example. He was the best Warrior last night. And he overcame the slump he was in the past few games. But what I really liked about him last night, was after the game, he lingered back and congratulated Lebron. He might have been the only Warrior to do that. He earned a lot of respect from me for that. Im sure JDW liked that gesture too. Hopefully he learned from his suspension to tone down the dirty plays.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message AIM Address
jdw
Site Admin


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 17247

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Terrific end to a terrific season. Not the team that I wanted to see wins, but it was historic in a different fashion.

I'd take Curry over Klay in a second. Suspect 29 GM's would as well. Only Phil would take Klay.

Steph was banged up, which changed his game after he came back from the combo of ankle and knee injuries. Shit happens, and he's hardly the first player we've seen have to deal with injuries. They just came at a bad time.

One could say things came easy for Steph over the past two seasons, but that's missing half the equation. They did come easy for him because he worked so hard over the years to improve. They made the game feel effortless to him, even as he was putting all the effort into it. 67-15 + NBA Title + 73-9 + Comeback against the Thunder... that stuff does impact how one thinks and plays. There is value in this loss to him as it will likely push him to clean up the sloppy elements of his came, the times he gets a little laxed out there, and the times where he kind of pouts a beat after a shot doesn't go down or what not.

It also felt like he had a bit of dick swinging going on when it came to switches. There were times when it felt like the Cavs wanted to put him in the pick to force him to switch off to Irving or Lebron, and Steph *attacked* the switch with some vigor. It often felt like too much vigor where Klay could have stuck with Irving and Steph could have stuck with his man, but Steph wanted to swing dicks defending Irving. The funny thing is that the stats actually showed he was doing a pretty decent job when defending Irving, while Irving was getting it by Steph... which oddly was a match up the Warriors didn't seem to seek out to much. Anyway, it felt too often that Steph switched when he didn't have to.

Perhaps that was my read of it, and maybe the Warriors staff wanted those quick switches. I just don't remember as much of it in the regular season. It felt like the KD+Westbrook thing was getting to him.

The dumb fouls were a problem, and an obvious one that's easy to work on.

Anyway, long and short of it: I don't think this is a bad thing for him or the Warriors. The team *won* last year and still found the motivation to come back better and more focused this season. Not a lot of teams do that after a 67-15 type of season. Those types of teams tend to coast through the regular season, and go into "flip the switch" mode. My guess is that both the players and the front office will focus on getting better. They certainly have the staff and players to do it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JAG



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 2298

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Curry over Klay means you don't value defense. Curry was historically great this year and still came up short. If the shooting levels off, is there enough there to be truly impactful? Not really.

You never gave Kobe enough credit for guarding the other team's biggest threat. It's your Achilles heel as well. ;)

As for being hurt, what's the excuse for last year?

Jagdip
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jdw
Site Admin


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 17247

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

corrado wrote:
Ive been saying for a while that Draymond could be more vital than the Splash Brothers. And Game 7 was another good example. He was the best Warrior last night. And he overcame the slump he was in the past few games. But what I really liked about him last night, was after the game, he lingered back and congratulated Lebron. He might have been the only Warrior to do that. He earned a lot of respect from me for that. Im sure JDW liked that gesture too. Hopefully he learned from his suspension to tone down the dirty plays.


Dray is my favorite player in the NBA, by a wide margin. He's a bit nuts, plays on that very thin line and at times goes over it. You wish that he didn't at times, but at other times that passion and intensity are vital for how he plays.

Steph+Klay+Dray are all part of one whole that make the Dubs what they are. Steph is the one unique, irreplaceable part of that trio.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jdw
Site Admin


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 17247

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 11:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JAG wrote:
Curry over Klay means you don't value defense.


I value defense. But he's on a team that typically had 4 "good-to-great" defensive players on the floor with him. He's far from the horrid defensive defender that he once one, and no one really confuses him with James Harden... or even the usually clueless level of defense of Love and Irving. He's not "good", and mostly needs to work more on his focus and dumb fouling than anything else.


Quote:
Curry was historically great this year and still came up short. If the shooting levels off, is there enough there to be truly impactful? Not really.


You've watched him play as much as I have. You've seen him improve defensively, and not some fake 2014/15 fake level improvement of Harden. You also see a lot of the areas where he needs to get better - finding the balance between ball hawking and staying with his man, being better on switch decisions, not making dumb fouls, and being better in transition defense. The transition defense is the only one that's really "lazy", and he's not as often lazy as Harden almost always is. Steph is often a smart defender, which isn't something one can often say about either Love or Irving... two guys who will get fit for Rings. Sometimes he's a bit too smart in thinking he has a chance to hawk a ball, or in reading someone coming into the lane to help... when he would be better off sticking with his man. But he also led the NBA in steals, so he does read things an an above average level. He has things that can be improved. But he's also a smart player, a hard working one and who has already improved on just about every aspect of his game. I'm not terribly worried about his defense.


Quote:
You never gave Kobe enough credit for guarding the other team's biggest threat. It's your Achilles heel as well. ;)


Kobe didn't always guard the other team's biggest threat. He also was inconsistent defensively, similar to Bron. Terrific when focused and when he wanted it, but he's also zone out or ball hawk. Let's not confuse Kobe's defense with Pippen or Jordan or Glove or Cooper. He wasn't that. Skills, talent and mind to be, but also would zone out. I don't even think he was all that great defensively in the second back-to-back. Good, but spotty.


Quote:
As for being hurt, what's the excuse for last year?


Kind of obvious ones: the injuries to Irving and Love transitioned the Cavs into a defensive team. Della and Shumpert are defensive players rather than offensive threats. Shumpert played 39, 37 & 36 minutes in the last 3 games. Della played 33 & 42 before the Dubs got him in all sorts of foul trouble in Game 6.

Those last three games when the Warriors figured things out?

Steph went for 28-5-6 on .492 shooting, .452 from 3P range. It's a myth that he choked in the Finals last season. He had one bad game (Game 2), but shot fine in Game 3 while being a bit loose with the ball.

It was Klay who was awful in Finals last year. ;)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JAG



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 2298

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When did Jordan guard anybody important after Pippen was on board? Jordan's myth expands every passing year.

Kobe guarded all PGs in 2000. All. And all the ones that torched Fisher after that. Which were many.

Curry's ineptness on defense made him the target for the final 3 games. Now it might be league-average, but it's still the weakness in Golden State's defense.

And I have to call BS on Curry was hurt. Can't get 38 in game 7 vs OKC and then blame injuries when you get punked in the Finals. C'mon. The reality is, like Nash, he's going to get dusted by all good PGs he faces. And he skated by last year not having to face any good ones in the playoffs as Conley and Kyrie got hurt.

Jagdip
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jdw
Site Admin


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 17247

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Awesome:

ESPN staffers troll Skip Bayless, who made a career out of trolling LeBron James, after Cavaliers win NBA Finals

Though Rich isn't with ESPN anymore, I love that they included this one:

Quote:
Rich Eisen @richeisen

And the best part: @KingJames ends @RealSkipBayless career at ESPN that he built by trolling on him by shutting him the F up.
7:45 PM - 19 Jun 2016


Wicked. :)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jdw
Site Admin


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 17247

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JAG wrote:
When did Jordan guard anybody important after Pippen was on board? Jordan's myth expands every passing year.


Who guarded the Laker's best player to start this game:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S73sVQC6QD4

Maybe we can both watch all of it and see if MJ stays on MJ who whole game.

MJ of course had Clyde in 1992:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG1LVGFx16M

I looked at the start of Game 1 of the 1993 Finals, and it wasn't Pipen on KJ - it was BJ. Which was common in those days - PG vs PG, unless you were trying to hide a defensive player (i.e. Magic).

Quote:
Kobe guarded all PGs in 2000. All. And all the ones that torched Fisher after that. Which were many.


Who was guarding AI here in Game 1?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteENJ8BUTw

Maybe that legendary performance by AI forced Phil to put Kobe on AI later in the series?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J169R27llFQ

Nope.

The myth of Kobe's defense has long been overplayed nonsense. He was, when he wanted to be and was focused, a very good defensive player. He wasn't MJ defensively, nor The Glove. :)


Quote:
Curry's ineptness on defense made him the target for the final 3 games. Now it might be league-average, but it's still the weakness in Golden State's defense.


CLE won the title starting:

Thompson = Good defensive player
Love = Terrible defensive player
Bron = Great defensive player when he wants to be and is focused
JR = not-a-good defensive player
Irving = bad defensive player

The Dubs lost while starting *collectively* a better set of defensive player. Green is one of the best 2-3 defensive players in the league. Thompson is a very good defensive guard. Barnes is a good defensive SF. Bogut is a very good defensive C... it's the only reason he plays. Swap out Bogut for Iggy, who is a terrific defensive player who was exceptional on Bron until (i) Green was suspended for Game 5 and (ii) hurt his back in Game 6. He actually was good on Bron again in Game 7.

Somehow, the Cavs were able to hide 2 poor defensive players, and a third who is a goofy defender.

Seriously... you're not going to the well on Curry's defense being a bar to that team winning. Good lord, you love Magic Johnson, who was a worse defensive player. :)


Quote:
And I have to call BS on Curry was hurt. Can't get 38 in game 7 vs OKC and then blame injuries when you get punked in the Finals.


Jabbar had a great Game 5 in 1980 on a horrible ankle. He was out the next game. Zeke was terrific in Game 6 in 1988 on a bad ankle. This is what he did the next game:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/198806210LAL.html

People can have a good game while injured. They even can have a GREAT game in the game they happen to be injured in. Heck, we saw that last year:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/201505020LAC.html

Jag - you know this. If you want to jump on Curry's cock for having a bad series, that's fine. He had a bad series. He played pretty dumb at bad times. But that doesn't mean he was 100% out there, or even close to it. You watched him play all year. I must have watched 45+ games of his in the regular season. How much did he look like Steph in the playoffs after the combo of first the Ankle than the MCL? Really only in spurts here and there, and then it wasn't the same as he'd looking when healthy in the regular season. It wasn't the defenses - he'd torched both in the regular season, and CLE still had players to exploit on the court that he couldn't torch like he normally could.


Quote:
C'mon. The reality is, like Nash, he's going to get dusted by all good PGs he faces.


Except he doesn't have to guard good PG's, just like Magic didn't. ;)


Quote:
And he skated by last year not having to face any good ones in the playoffs as Conley and Kyrie got hurt.


He wasn't on Kyrie in this one, anymore than he was on Westbrook. Klay takes them. Steph only gets them in switches.

Steph and the Warriors will win another title before we do. You're kind of like Steph's Skip Bayless with this. :)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
JAG



Joined: 27 Jul 2006
Posts: 2298

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are you really pretending the Pippen to Magic switch didn't change '91 Finals?

Kobe guarded guys at the end of games, not the beginning. Where's Yohe?

I'm not shouting down Curry. He had an incredible regular season, one of the best ever, but he's not nearly the player that season implies. This is all the same nonsense people rolled out about Nash. The minute you're hiding Curry, the minute I can't take him being a plus or even acceptable defender seriously. What is there when Curry isn't shooting it at an All-World level. A mistake prone guard you have to hide on defense. Luckily for him, he's almost always an All-World shooter.

And please don't invoke Magic or Bird until Curry plays a good Finals. ;)

Jagdip
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Steve Yohe



Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 3125
Location: Wonderful Montebello CA

PostPosted: Mon Jun 20, 2016 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

GS got beat. If they played again, they would get beat again. James is the best player & his team believed in him & he made them better.

Green is a dick....fuck him. He'll mess himself up down the line. Ego will kill him, if just hasn't happened yet.

Curry getting busted up is something that will happen every year in the playoffs. He had shots in that last game...his shots. He missed. It's called peaking too soon. GS did it after they won a title with Barry.

Hey John....you were wrong....again....when do I eat?

Cleveland played great defense all thru the playoffs. James isn't a good defensive player???? Your HI.

I told you Cleveland would win the thing long before the playoffs started & I said it more that once. I felt it all the way.

GS is done. It's over.

Like Jag, I take Klay over Curry.---Steve Yohe
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
jdw
Site Admin


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 17247

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JAG wrote:
Are you really pretending the Pippen to Magic switch didn't change '91 Finals?


MJ started Game 2 on Magic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QO2ZRhkuVKk

He starts Game 5 on Magic:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbSA4fmyZrw

So yeah... Pippen on Magic changed the series... not the guy who averaged 30-6-11-3-2 on .551 shooting while the Bulls swept the last four games. ;)


Quote:
Kobe guarded guys at the end of games, not the beginning.


Ah... so he saved his energy until the end.

Did Glove do that? Or Rodman?


Code:
And please don't invoke Magic or Bird until Curry plays a good Finals. ;)


Good? 26-5-6 which in a series isn't good? That's 28-5-6 (.452 from 3P) in the final 3 games to close out the series isn't good?

Come on... stop trolling. ;)
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
jdw
Site Admin


Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 17247

PostPosted: Tue Jun 21, 2016 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Steve Yohe wrote:
James isn't a good defensive player???? Your HI.


"Bron = Great defensive player when he wants to be and is focused" -jdw a few posts up

I understand that reading is hard when you want to crap on someone.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The OtherArena Forum Index -> Sports All times are GMT - 7 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3 ... , 31, 32, 33  Next
Page 32 of 33

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
The OtherArena topic RSS feed 


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group